Unschooling, University and More: An Interview

How do unschoolers get into university? Does unschooling prepare kids for the university experience? How do they get on studying in an educational institution for the first time? When my son Callum was 22, we discussed these questions in a video interview. Here’s the transcript of our conversation.

Sue : Callum, you were homeschooled right up until the time you went to university. Did you enjoy homeschooling?

Callum: I did, yes.

Sue : What in particular did you enjoy about it?

Callum : I enjoyed being able to study subjects of my own interest, and the freedom to do stuff as a family together, while also being able to join in with the sort of extracurricular activities of the school kids, such as St John Ambulance.

Sue : So tell me about St. John Ambulance. What was your involvement with it?

Callum : I volunteered with St. John Ambulance for quite a number of years and worked within the organization from the cadets through to an adult and partial teaching role, actually going out and running first aid posts, teaching younger cadets as well.

Sue : Now I know that you really enjoyed your experience with St John Ambulance and you were very good at it. And you were very confident and had no trouble with the practical side of it. It was one of your passions at one time, so where did that lead?

Callum : It led me to start looking for a career in the healthcare industry. I chose to do nursing through university. I thought that that would be a good way to continue on in my interest.

Sue : Did you have any trouble getting into university?

Callum : Not really. Well, not at all in fact. I had to do a couple of units through Open University (online) and based on my results from that, they accepted me into an on-campus university.

Sue : I seem to remember we also got together a few documents, such as certificates showing that you were the cadet of the year a number of times, and some references from other St John Ambulance officers, to put with your application. So your practical experience there, and your passion might have helped you as well.

Callum : Oh yes, definitely. I’m very fortunate to have some good references.

Sue : So you went off to university. I remember you got your driver’s license and you drove up to Sydney and began a new phase of your life. Tell me about that experience. It was totally different from homeschooling. Did you find it difficult to settle into university work?

Callum : Not really. I think my university experience was very different from the other students. The very first lecture we went to, they actually mentioned to the students coming out of high school that university would be much less structured than they were used to. But for me, it was almost like taking a step backwards. It was more structured with the lectures but more so with the essays and the other work that had to be put in.

Sue : I don’t remember you actually doing many essays when you were studying at home. Were you able to cope with those when you went to university?

Callum : Oh yes, definitely. We did creative writing at home and writing an essay, it’s very formulaic and logical. So it was very easy to adjust to writing in a certain way.

Sue : A lot of people might not know this. They know all the girls are big writers and so am I. But they probably don’t know that you at one time used to love writing as well. I don’t know if you still do any, but yes, you used to do a lot of writing. Do you agree?

Callum : Oh yes. I did articles for a homeschooling newsletter as well as other things related to the study I was doing.

Sue : So you’re a pretty good writer yourself. Now I do remember when you were at uni and you said that a lot of the students who’d come out of school really didn’t know what they wanted to do. They weren’t there because they were gripped by a passion as such, which got you into an awful lot of trouble when you went to your tutorials. Tell me about that. You know: when you were asking too many questions, wanting to know the ins and outs of everything.

Callum : Yes. Well, having a real interest in the subject I was doing, I sort of went beyond the expectations of the teachers sometimes. I wanted to know more than the information they were giving us. Maybe I was supposed to learn it at a later point. But you know, rather than just the basics that they were giving to me, I wanted to know all the ins and outs of how everything worked.

Sue : So you were curious and you asked too many questions and held up the class and you got quite a name for yourself.

Callum : Yes and a name as a homeschooler.

Sue : Yes, I do remember you came home one day and you said a question got asked to the class and the tutor said anyone can answer but not that homeschooled student.

Callum : That’s right. I had one particular tutor who had very negative views on homeschooling, and at my very first tutorial, we had to say what school we came from, or what our previous experiences were. And when my turn came up, I said, ‘I’m Callum and I was homeschooled’. She instantly said, oh well, I obviously had no social skills and no knowledge. But by the end of the semester, she had changed her view quite a lot. Yeah, we got on very well by the end of it.

Sue : So you think you were a very social person?

Callum : I think so. I have no trouble talking to anyone really of any age. I quite enjoyed talking to the students at that university and the lecturers.

Sue : So even though you’d never been to a learning institution before, you found it quite easy to come in and be part of the class, part of the lectures? You got on with people?

Callum : Oh yes. I found a group of like-minded students who were really driven to do their work. Yeah, we got on very well and worked well together. And I was able to go and talk to the tutors and lecturers after the sessions and get the extra information I needed.

Sue : You were doing your Bachelor of Nursing as a part-time degree. What were you doing at the same time?

Callum : At the same time as I applied for uni, I got a job part-time working for Aldi supermarkets just as a store assistant. I managed to continue working there up until- well, I’m still working there so-.

Sue : So you were working and studying at the same time?

Callum : Yeah.

Sue : Now people might not know but we do obviously, that after, I don’t know, a couple of years—Did you do a year and a half of the part-time course? -you actually dropped out of the Bachelor of Nursing degree. You changed your mind about what you wanted to do, decided that nursing wasn’t really for you after all. Now some people might say that really you should have persevered until the end. That it’s not a good thing to throw in the towel. That what we start we have to finish. What do you think about that?

Callum : I disagree. I think that it wasn’t right and I wouldn’t have been happy working in that industry. It wasn’t the practical side. I still do enjoy the helping people and the first aid aspect of everything. But the politics and the way the healthcare system worked really didn’t appeal. In fact, I found the way some people worked within the system was quite a turn-off. I think that you really need to work in a job that you enjoy especially if you’re going to do it for the rest of your life.

Sue : So it’s okay to change your mind, you think? That the sensible thing to do is to acknowledge that and to pursue a different pathway?

Callum : Oh, certainly yes. It’s never too late to start again especially-

Sue : -especially when you’re only 20?

Callum : That’s right.

Sue : And would you also say that every experience you have does teach you something and that you take that forward with you?

Callum : Oh yes. Even my experiences at university and experiences working as a trainee nurse were– I’ve used them later on in life in different situations.

Sue : So you left uni and what happened then?

Callum : I went to my boss at Aldi and I said, ‘Look, I’m dropping out of university. Is it possible to get full-time work?’ And she actually turned around and offered me a position as a trainee store manager within that store which was very flattering actually. I hadn’t worked full-time there ever and for her to say that was very kind.

Sue : So then you started a new career at Aldi. How long have you been there now?

Callum :  Four and a half years.

Sue : So tell me a little bit about your job at Aldi? Is it a challenging job? Is there enough there to keep you interested in it?

Callum : Certainly for the time I’ve been there it’s been challenging and enjoyable. It’s not a job I’m passionate about. I think I could continue working there for a while longer but eventually- It’s a pretty routine job and it can get a little dull and repetitive.

Sue : But you have learnt a number of skills while you’ve been there?

Callum : Oh definitely yes.

Sue : And what sort of things do you think that you have learnt?

Callum : A lot of social skills, working with the different customers we have and the other different employees, time management, working to standards. They have very high standards. They demand high standards from their staff there. And also personally driving yourself to achieve and perform. Especially in the last six months, I’ve really pushed myself to work better within the company and have seen good results, I believe.

Sue : A  lot of people say that unschoolers are not disciplined and they can’t get up in the morning and get on with life. Tell me what time you get up in the morning Callum to get to work?

Callum : I wake up at 4:30 in the morning. When I was working as a trainee manager, I’d get up at 4:30 and would work through till close at 7:30 pm and get home at about 8 o’clock at night with a half hour break in the middle, so I don’t believe that’s true.

Sue : That’s a long day. So yes, unschoolers are not lazy. They’re very hardworking. And when you have to be up early to do something, you can do it, is that right?

Callum : Yes, that’s right.

In case you’d like to watch the video, here it is:

Hopefully, I’ll post the transcript of part 2 of From Unschooling to University and Work: An Interview another time!

I’d like to thank Hayley from the blog Taking a Kinder Path for transcribing this video. Hayley is a very beautiful and kind friend. She has spent hours transcribing videos for me. Together we are spreading the unschooling message!